Professor Sir John Lawton: Podcast Q&A

David recently caught up with Professor Sir John Lawton, an individual of extensive knowledge and eminence in the ecology and nature restoration field.

As well as being an academic who has written over 300 scientific papers including ‘Making Space for Nature’, a review of England’s wildlife launched in 2009, John joined the Natural Environment Search Council Centre for Population Biology as CEO, then on to CEO of Natural Environment Research Council (NERC).

John has also been chair of the Royal Commission on Environmental Pollution and is currently vice president of the RSPB.

David Hill (DH): What role and impact do you think your review, Making Space for Nature (2010) has had and is still having?

John Lawton (JL): If anybody had said to me in 2010 that Making Space for Nature would be not only still being talked about, but actually more influential than it ever has been, both within the UK and across the continent of Europe, I wouldn't have believed you.

It's quite humbling that it has made such a difference. The report was timely in the sense that we were asked to do it by the government, despite the Government changing from Labour to Conservative halfway through the report.

However, the incoming Conservative Government agreed to act upon it and took it forward. So it was timely, but more importantly, it was written by the committee and different chapters were composed by different people, so it has a whole host of expert contributions. It took six weeks to turn it into plain English, but I was determined to make it accessible for all.

Also, the science within the report was rigorous, we had a wonderful panel, and it's been cited over 4000-5000 times. It was also beautifully produced, with lots of great graphics in it which made the science easier to explain and understand.

Finally, the review can’t be politicised because it came in under Labour, but was published under the Conservative Government. Therefore,  it is devoid of any potential labelling that may suggest a bias towards a specific political agenda.

Where do you see nature in five years' time?
For the last 100 years, we’ve been establishing nature reserves, which haven’t worked as a solution to the biodiversity crisis.

While the state of our environment would be much worse without those areas, they're simply not big enough, not joined up enough, not managed well enough and there aren't enough of them.

We need bigger and better examples of nature restoration.

However, the conservation sector, statutory and voluntary, is never going to be able to have enough land under its control to deliver nature restoration that makes a difference. For example, the aspiration for 30% of UK land to be managed for nature by 2030 is not going to be possible with traditional nature reserve management.

However, if you take all the other ways that you can actually deliver for nature, this might be achievable.

This might look like working with utility companies or working with landowners who want to look after nature. It might also take the form of corporations buying biodiversity credits that are now available from companies like Environment Bank.

There are a variety of ways we can work within industry and society to deliver benefits, which would allow us to achieve 30% by 2030, but it won’t be delivered by traditional means.

The environment, the funding that it can bring, and the kind of political, economic, and business landscape that is now emerging actually fills me with a huge amount of hope.

What action would you like to see taken to encourage nature restoration at scale?
There are a number of routes. Environment Bank’s Habitat Banks are one obvious way to encourage landowners to do the right thing, but there are many other things you can do, such as carbon credits.

Overall, I’d like to see some really major habitat restoration and recreation projects, so in essence, the big stuff at scale. However, seeing individual landowners doing their bit for nature is very encouraging - it really adds up.

Fortunately, I think there's probably more habitat now being restored and recreated in the UK that is actually being destroyed by development, so I would just hope that nature continues to be a top priority.

What do you think will keep nature a priority?
I think keeping nature economically visible is essential.  For many landowners, nature and its restoration have become an income stream generator and that's really important, especially for farmers struggling financially due to the end of farming subsidies.

As long as nature remains related to financial loss or gain, it will stay on the agenda of those in the rural workforce and corporations dedicated to meeting ESG targets.

What do you think makes nature restoration significant to farmers in particular?
Restoring biodiversity on the land through something like a Habitat Bank makes a regenerative farming model more easily accessible and attainable for farmers. Often, inputs like pesticides and fertilisers are increasing rapidly in price, outpacing the rate at which farmers can increase their productivity.

Farmers are going to make more money by producing less and having less input, which is why many have turned to regenerative farming rather than intensive agriculture. This method of farming will be cheaper, encourage the land and animals to work in tandem, and benefit the environment abundantly.

What was it that sparked your interest in the natural world?
My interest began at a very young age. When I was seven years old, my family had gone on holiday to Lithinson.

It was just after the war, and there were some little birds on the beach because in those days, there was hardly anybody on the beach. I had no idea what they were but I was absolutely fascinated by them. I kept asking my parents what they were and they didn't know. But they said if I was very good on my holidays, I could have a bird book.

I got the Observer’s Book of British Birds, and as mentioned, at that point I was seven. By the time I was eight, the book was worn out.

I’ve now been watching birds for over 70 years and I've been very lucky to pursue an interest in natural history for the whole of my life.

Is there anything else you’d like to add?
When it comes to nature restoration, I think we've turned the corner. I’m genuinely optimistic about what is to come.